A 'Dirty Shame'

As the Right Wing wraps Samuel Alito up in a festive black robe, hoping to sell his Supreme Court appointment for Christmas (a holiday they again warn is being aggressively dismantled by liberals), celluloid iconoclast John Waters wants nothing more than to revel in the season — boozy familial fisticuffs, consumer despair, goopy cornflake-wreath cookies and all.

In a career spanning five decades, the Baltimore native has gone from cranking out cheap, underground films to producing big-budget counterculture comedies, all the while keeping his sense of the absurd and tawdry aesthetic intact. Through crass canonizations such as 1988’s “Female Trouble” and more mainstream comedies such as 1986’s

“Hairspray” (since adapted for Broadway), Waters introduced audiences to endearing antiheroes such as drag star Divine and Edith Massey, aka Edie the Egg Lady.

Waters recently appeared at UCLA’s Royce Hall with electronica queen Peaches. His photo exhibit, “John Waters: Change of Life,” is on display at the Orange County Museum of Art through Jan. 15. Waters also released “A John Waters Christmas,” a retro batch of musical kitsch.

Pasadena Weekly: What is it that you love about Christmas?

John Waters: I love how it makes people mental. There’s pressure on you about money, and there’s pressure on you about family, and there’s pressure on you about getting the right gift. If you can go through it all with a sense of humor, it can be a delightful time of year. If you’re a criminal, it’s a really good time of year. There’re presents in people’s cars waiting for you to steal; people have more money in their pocket if you’re a mugger. … If I hear “Little Drummer Boy” one more time, I feel like I’m going crazy. That’s why I put out my Christmas album, which basically has very obscure Christmas carols on it that aren’t campy. There’s no irony in those songs — “Happy Birthday Jesus” by Little Cindy — they were all made to be good songs, something just went a little wrong …

What’s the strangest gift you’ve ever given or received?

I gave Divine a mink coat once in 1970 and it was a used one, believe me, and he wore it in “Multiple Maniacs.” He was more obsessed by Christmas than I was. I think he was damaged because his parents made him be Santa Claus at the nursery school just because he was overweight. But he loved Christmas — God, did he love Christmas. I spent a lot of Christmases with him. I guess the worst was when he almost went to prison for writing bad checks to give everybody all these great gifts. He always lived as if he was a rich movie star even though he didn’t have a penny sometimes.  He gave me a great cashmere blanket that I still have in my bedroom. Divine and I together were a good outlet for both of our angers and rage. Divine knew how to say my words. He was kind of like my Godzilla in a way. It was Godzilla and Jayne Mansfield put together. I think it was liberating to him, too, because Divine was never dressed in drag. That’s what he did for work. He was kind of a shy gentleman in real life.

Do you view yourself as a champion of First Amendment freedom-of-speech rights?

Certainly. I’ve fought censorship my whole life. I think some of my best press agents have been censorship from the Catholic Church to the Maryland Film Censor Board. You know, the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) is a censor board. They’re the hardest, because they’re nice to deal with. … I’m always amazed that they still do that, especially in my films, which are non-explicit and joyous comedies. I don’t know how you can really be obscene if you’re joyous.

Does the MPAA still try to mess with your films?

Truly. “A Dirty Shame” was rated NC-17 and I lost the appeal, and many theaters wouldn’t play it. When it came out on video, I had to do a “neuter” version because Blockbuster and Wal-Mart and all those stores won’t carry NC-17 movies. I had to do a special version for, I guess, the less discriminate shoppers that get their DVDs at Wal-Mart.

That’s funny.

To you maybe [laughs], but it wasn’t very funny to me. … It’s not just Wal-Mart. You think Target tries to be so hip; they won’t carry NC-17 or unrated movies either. I tried to cut it for an R rating with the MPAA. I really had to cut so much out and put alternative takes that you’re forced to do in your contract for cable television. So it’s the baby version of “A Dirty Shame.” It’s kind of a children’s version they play [on cable].

As someone who satirized extreme fetish and violence onscreen, how do you feel about Web sites like nowthatsfuckedup.com, where the bodies of murdered Iraqis have been posted by military personnel as trade for access to porn?

I don’t want to see that. Now, see, real violence I don’t like. That’s snuff movies. … As a matter of fact, I turn my head away on the news sometimes; I’m fairly squeamish about that. I like violence that you know is fake and then it can be enjoyable and funny. I don’t think anyone that saw “The Texas Chainsaw Massacre,” even the least discriminating moron, thought, ‘Did they really get hurt?’ I guess there are people that could argue that eating shit was violent psychologically, but I think that mostly my movies are meant to be funny.

Have you found some good material from this presidential administration to satirize in film?

I certainly didn’t vote for Bush, but I’ve lived through Nixon. I’ve lived through his father. I’ve lived through a lot of terrible times. It seems almost that there’s not a youth movement because he keeps stabbing himself in his foot so many times. I think there’s no need for that. He’s his own best enemy. I don’t go along with Reagan being a saint either. [It was kind of scandalous] when he died, how they really made him into a saint. There was never any bad stuff. It was nauseating. Certainly, I wish there was a youth movement to satirize. Unfortunately, there isn’t. [When I was growing up] the first thing I wanted to be was a beatnik, and then there was hippies and then there was punks and then there was grunge and then wiggers. What now? It seems like there’s so much to rebel against and everybody’s not rebelling. Why isn’t ACT UP doing something with this pope? I mean, how much more anti-gay stuff can the Catholic Church get away with without it being a hate crime? I’m for using humor as terrorism, which is what the yippies did in the ’60s. I wish the young people would use that again.

You’ve showcased obscure talents in your films such as Patricia Hearst and Pia Zadora. Is there anybody you’ve tried to get that you couldn’t?

I don’t think of either of them as obscure. Patricia Hearst, she’s been in about six of my movies, so I think she’s a gifted comedienne that is a real survivor. Pia Zadora, yes, at times, she got bad movie reviews, but she got great reviews for her singing voice. I was very proud to make a movie where Pia Zadora got all good reviews, so I never, ever try to cast somebody that I think is so bad, they’re good. I don’t do that so much anymore. I have to get films financed. I think “Cry Baby” was kind of the height of when I did, as some people would call it, stunt casting. I guess that’s supposed to be negative, but it wasn’t to me. … I like to surprise you with my casting, but I never put anybody in it that I don’t think will be good for the part.

Note: In his 1969 short film, “The Diane Linkletter Story,” Waters and his cast improvised a reenactment of the suicide of Diane Linkletter, the daughter of conservative 1960s TV host Art Linkletter. On Oct. 4, 1969, Diane Linkletter leapt from her sixth-floor apartment in Shoreham Towers, just off the Sunset Strip in West Hollywood. It was said she had jumped while on the granddaddy of acid trips.
 
What do you recall about the making of “The Diane Linkletter Story”?

One of the things that I want for Christmas is her reputation back, because, you know, supposedly she jumped out of a window on LSD. Well, recently there were Nixon White House tapes released where Art Linkletter and Nixon conspired to blame [Timothy] Leary for this, because she actually had not had LSD for a year before she jumped. I feel that [Linkletter] exploited her worse than I did. He put out a record called “We Love You; Call Collect.” He also put out a book, “Drugs at My Doorstep.” So he didn’t waste any time in turning her death [from] drugs into product, which I found more offensive than what we did. We felt like we were her, because all our parents said if you take LSD, you’re going to go crazy. It wasn’t until 20-some years later that I found out that she wasn’t even on LSD when she jumped. Oddly enough, I have a friend who found out after he bought a condo that he lives in the apartment where she [jumped] and it really freaked him out. I keep going up there and trying to have a séance, but so far nothing’s happened.

What’s your take on Laura Bush?

I like her better than her husband. At least she seems like she has a sense of humor once in a while. At least her charity is the library, something I very much agree with. She certainly dresses like a nerd, but I don’t hate her with the passion that I find for her moronic husband.
 
What would be a good role for her in one of your films?

Oh, probably just as a crack whore or something — something playing against type — or a rap star. I think that would be good.

What role would you give her husband?

I wouldn’t. He wouldn’t get a callback.